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  • Thank you to everyone who reached out with concern about the upcoming UK legislation which requires online communities to be compliant regarding illegal content. As a result of hard work and research by members of this community (chiefly iainbhx) and other members of communities UK-wide, the decision has been taken that the Sea Lion Press Forum will continue to operate. For more information, please see this thread.

This forum may be closing down in March 2025

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Meadow

Not Going Anywhere
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Sea Lion Press staff
Published by SLP
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This isn't a message I wanted to write, but having been made aware of this a few days ago and now discussed it with some forum members, it feels right to be open about this situation.

From the off, let me say this: The publishing company Sea Lion Press is not in any danger. It may, however, need to close down the forum in order to safely keep operating.

This is all because of new legislation in the UK relating to 'online harms'. While it has noble intentions to do with enforcing culpability of major social media giants when it comes to children's exposure to inappropriate material or radicalisation, it has unfortunately got very few exemptions for small (or, in our case, microscopic) organisations and communities. This means that the rules designed for megacorporations must be complied with by tiny organisations like us. To give one simple example, the documentation is 155,000 words long - and we have to read it and make sure we are compliant before mid-March 2025.

There is a pessimistic summary from a long-standing cycling forum here. It is hard for me to escape the same conclusions at the moment. The core issue is that our moderators would need to remove 'harmful' content at a rate which is potentially incompatible with the size of team and volunteer nature of the job. Further to this, relying on volunteer moderators in and of itself may not actually be compliant in the first place.


tl;dr: legislation designed to make sure Meta take proper care of younger users now also appears to be requiring that SLP take steps on content moderation which go way beyond what can be expected of our volunteer team, or myself with the low income it generates for me, and the risk is a fine of up to £18 million. While SLP is a limited company and thus my exposure to this would not be personal (though I am double checking this!), if something bad did occur, SLP would immediately go into liquidation and I would face personal consequences as the director of a bankrupted company. I hope it is not controversial for me to say that this is not something I can risk.

I should also emphasise that this is not a call for fundraising or similar - this community's support for SLP (and indeed individual members in need) has been greatly heartening over the years, but I want to be clear that this is not a problem that can be fixed with money, at least not on the scale that some kind of fundraiser would resolve. This is about the size of SLP as an organisation, and what can realistically be expected of a team that is almost entirely volunteers, and the remuneration people do receive is very low.

There are a few unknowns here - more clarity will come in January, apparently. Friends and members of the community with some experience in this field are also examining the rules, because in spite of the above, there are a handful of things which suggest some exemptions are possible, or that there are lower-intensity ways to be compliant if you're a small organisation.

So, we are in the woods. We may be out of them in January. I will not say any tearful goodbyes to this place just yet, and I would like it if others also held back on that. If the time comes for that, then we are a community of writers and, as the LFGSS post says to its own users, there are ways to move this community somewhere else (ironically, probably to a platform owned by a tech giant) and keep our connections alive.

And there is hope. There may be a way for us to become compliant. But there also may not be.

Thank you for reading, and you'll get updates whenever I have them.

EDIT 1: @iainbhx has found this helpful summary, which we are picking through to see what is viable. The fact we have a report function already appears to be useful.
 
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Does anyone have a standard text we could use about concerns in writing to our respective MPs?

Here's what I've got so far, but I'd be the first to admit it feels incomplete and informal--if anyone has any further suggestions I'd love to hear them.

Dear [MP NAME]

I am writing to you today to express my concern over the new online safety regime’s regulations and the burden it places on small websites and discussion forums, such as community information websites, hobbyist discussion pages, and even annotated local information maps.

The law is designed under the assumption that every site on which people have discussions has a professional management team of full-time employees, which is simply not the case for many small webforums. As a long-time user of these sites, most of them have small moderation teams of volunteers and take in roughly enough money to keep the lights on—but still provide space for engaged communities and interesting discussions. With Ofcom not even releasing the actual guidelines for small sites for another month, these sites are staring down the gun-barrel of potential £18 million fines for non-compliance with laws they haven’t been told about. They want to comply so they can keep going, but find themselves unable to.

Small sites like these are what make the Internet liveable, and they’re facing extinction under these measures. The tragedy is how easily this could be sorted out if Ofcom were willing to be more transparent about their goals, and willing to engage with smaller web-users rather than major tech giants.

I’ve CC’d in the current Minister for Science, Information, and Technology, who has ultimate power over the legislation, and I sincerely hope he’ll do the right thing and examine what exemptions need to be made. I would be grateful if you raised my concerns in Parliament, and if you found any way to push the issue further I’d be very grateful.

Sincerely,
[USER'S NAME]
 
Thanks for all the details Tom, much appreciated.

Noting you're already in touch with a cycling forum, I'll post here my suggestions on organising:

There must hundreds of platforms like this in UK, providing a variety of community spaces from creative works to gardening to industry topics. Find them, get together, explain to Ofcom and MPs what UK will lose.

Xenforo software has a community area - can probably find other endangered fora there. There may be groups more powerful and influential than SLP who are users (hard to imagine, I know :ROFLMAO:) maybe even unions or religious organisations.


Create an association of community fora to request changes to requirements for these types of communities

Xenforo themselves should be interested, as they will lose UK clients. They may be willing to help
 
Here's what I've got so far, but I'd be the first to admit it feels incomplete and informal--if anyone has any further suggestions I'd love to hear them.
Thanks very much, I'll use that as a basis and write to (checks notes) Louise Haigh. Well, I'm sure she's not got anything else on right now...
 
Obviously we can hope that this is improved and does not pass but– in the event that this new legislation does go through and it's not viable to continue running the forum as it is, one possibility I would perhaps suggest is entirely separating off the SLP forum from the rest of the website, and handing over the running of the forum to a trusted individual who is not based in the UK.

I assume that would allow the forum to stay in use for us unless the UK government actually decides to start blocking access to non-UK-based websites which are not compliant with the legislation.
 
Here's what I've got so far, but I'd be the first to admit it feels incomplete and informal--if anyone has any further suggestions I'd love to hear them.

Oh how about this paragraph:

The recent Government White Paper on local government reform talks of empowering local communities through a right-to-buy for key community assets such as pubs, leisure venues and other such locations recognised as 'Third Spaces' vital to ensuring that our local communities remain flourishing and vibrant. Small fora- especially those managed on a volunteer basis by and for individual communities are the equivalent online spaces to these physical locations, and deserve recognition of the similar role they play for many people in this country- including individuals with reduced mobility or other physical and mental health conditions for whom accessing the equivalent physical conditions is difficult, if not impossible. It is also likely the case that some of the very organisations who local communities would be turning to to purchase and run community assets will be based in, and organised through, small fora such as these.
 
Obviously we can hope that this is improved and does not pass but– in the event that this new legislation does go through and it's not viable to continue running the forum as it is, one possibility I would perhaps suggest is entirely separating off the SLP forum from the rest of the website, and handing over the running of the forum to a trusted individual who is not based in the UK.

I assume that would allow the forum to stay in use for us unless the UK government actually decides to start blocking access to non-UK-based websites which are not compliant with the legislation.

the problem is that it appears the legislation focuses on UK-based actions and therefore not just UK-owned platforms need to be compliant, I think
 
For Liberals the technology spokesperson is Victoria Collins.

The shadow minister is Alan Mak.

Two people to possibly include in any CC’s.

Oh how about this paragraph:

Thanks for the feedback--have added Alex's paragraph and a bit elaborating on the CCs. (Note my MP is a Lib Dem--you might want to tweak as appropriate.)

I’ve CC’d in the current Minister for Science, Information, and Technology, who has ultimate power over the legislation, and I sincerely hope he’ll do the right thing and examine what exemptions need to be made. I’ve done the same for your own party’s spokeswoman on the subject, who I have no doubt will continue your party’s strong defence of online freedoms, as well as the current Shadow Minister, who can effectively hold the government to account on this matter. I would be grateful if you raised my concerns in Parliament, and if you found any way to push the issue further I’d be very grateful.
 
the problem is that it appears the legislation focuses on UK-based actions and therefore not just UK-owned platforms need to be compliant, I think

Yes, it's extraterritorial

How do they hope to enforce it for platforms owned and operated outside the UK? Just ban access, there's Very Probably No (VPN) way around that.

If nothing is done I suspect the end result will be forums of this size will basically be told to chuff off and go and be a Discord channel.

You need to go all the way back to the first chapters to see Discord seeded as the end of SLP.
 
If nothing is done I suspect the end result will be forums of this size will basically be told to chuff off and go and be a Discord channel.

I don't even think that would be viable? Because even if we set one up and @Meadow is an admin or whatever, doesn't that still create the same liabilities? Even if under Discord as a whole company? And the same with a Subreddit etc?
 
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