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Alternate History: S,T,U
- Thread starter Gary Oswald
- Start date
"Was real Cuba wanked or screwed?" is an interesting point, a really confrontational tale on the "is utopia or dystopia" - even asking "is the revolution itself a wank or a screw" of people who think Cuba got done over is a politic question, was that worse than what could have otherwise happened or was Cuba's only chance if improving to throw out Batista first or insert view here? And of course that's before we ask any Cubans or Cuban diaspora, who actually live there/had family there
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- NYC (né Falkirk)
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First line: "SCREWS AND WANKS"
Sea Lion Press: Adults Only
The end of that section, as to what actually constitutes a country doing better, and using Cuba as an OTL example of how it can be either depending on who you ask, made for a great juxtaposition with the Utopia entry.
In the same way your Utopia is likely a reflection of your own values, so too is screwing/wanking a particular country. Witness how much wanking on the Old Country years ago invariably meant "more of that country's colour on the map", very rarely would it be an introspective bettering of that country's social safety net and wealth distribution.
On the flip side of that, I've no doubt many in the UK would consider a federal, republican, hovercraft infested version of that country with Finland levels of social services a worse Britain than OTL, but to me it's infinitely better and that's just taking the hovercraft into account.
Sea Lion Press: Adults Only
The end of that section, as to what actually constitutes a country doing better, and using Cuba as an OTL example of how it can be either depending on who you ask, made for a great juxtaposition with the Utopia entry.
In the same way your Utopia is likely a reflection of your own values, so too is screwing/wanking a particular country. Witness how much wanking on the Old Country years ago invariably meant "more of that country's colour on the map", very rarely would it be an introspective bettering of that country's social safety net and wealth distribution.
On the flip side of that, I've no doubt many in the UK would consider a federal, republican, hovercraft infested version of that country with Finland levels of social services a worse Britain than OTL, but to me it's infinitely better and that's just taking the hovercraft into account.
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- he/him
In the same way your Utopia is likely a reflection of your own values, so too is screwing/wanking a particular country. Witness how much wanking on the Old Country years ago invariably meant "more of that country's colour on the map", very rarely would it be an introspective bettering of that country's social safety net and wealth distribution.
There was a thread on AH.com which was titled 'a Germanwank' and involved Germany getting hammered in wars in the early 20th century and it became increasingly apparent that the writer, who was german, meant it was a germanwank because it was positing a germany with much less blood on their hands. And that was his main goal in 'wanking' the country, avoiding the genocides.
It really struck with me.
Talwar
Well-Known Sword
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Screws and wanks?
Won't somebody think of the children?
Won't somebody think of the children?
Turtledove is an interesting case study for both personal and literary criticism reasons. (And I'm not talking about his different kind of 'screw' scenes, or how his work gets worse as it gets longer).
As an artist, his parallel-filled, obvious divergence AH shows the kind of compromises you need to make to appeal to a wider audience, especially when you're doing "AH As A Genre" and not "AH As A Setting".
Personally, I came (just?) after Turtledove's crest. In the late 2000s was when I got into alternate history, and I mostly just found the relevant stuff on the internet itself. Turtledove was an author I read, and a lot of his books I liked, but he wasn't the entry-level bottom rung the way he's been described as for a lot of people. For another genre, Clive Cussler very much was this for me and cheap thrillers.
Since then, the bottom rung has shifted ever more towards Paradox games and, more frequently, people just jumping into AH communities online.
As an artist, his parallel-filled, obvious divergence AH shows the kind of compromises you need to make to appeal to a wider audience, especially when you're doing "AH As A Genre" and not "AH As A Setting".
Personally, I came (just?) after Turtledove's crest. In the late 2000s was when I got into alternate history, and I mostly just found the relevant stuff on the internet itself. Turtledove was an author I read, and a lot of his books I liked, but he wasn't the entry-level bottom rung the way he's been described as for a lot of people. For another genre, Clive Cussler very much was this for me and cheap thrillers.
Since then, the bottom rung has shifted ever more towards Paradox games and, more frequently, people just jumping into AH communities online.
Max Sinister
Well-known member
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- The Chaos Timeline
German AH is much weaker (as in, much fewer authors and fans) than that of the Anglosphere. It might be that Turtledove not allowing German translations of his work bears part of the responsibility for that.
- Location
- Derbyshire
German AH is much weaker (as in, much fewer authors and fans) than that of the Anglosphere. It might be that Turtledove not allowing German translations of his work bears part of the responsibility for that.
I don't think it's that surprising when you consider how common Nazi victory scenarios are in English AH really- and you'd don't really need an 'It Happened Here' style fiction when it actually did happen here.