Discuss this article by Gary Oswald here.
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Africa During the Scramble: The Kat River Experiment
- Thread starter Thande
- Start date
Ricardolindo
Well-known member
- Location
- Portugal
Very interesting article. I have read a bit about the Cape Colony. I have posted here about English and Portuguese Cape Colonies.Discuss this article by Gary Oswald here.
I didn't know about the early suffrage (and its end) in south Africa, that's fascinating
It seems one component of the equation is also there is much less need for arming natives once most of land is conquered and the next neighbours are European colonial powers with whom there's at least an attempt made at solving colonial dispute diplomatically rather than by war, and so the need for soldiers from the Khoisan or the Mfengu recedes and if they don't need to have bullets, the settlers don't see the point of granting them ballots either.
- Pronouns
- he/him
It seems one component of the equation is also there is much less need for arming natives once most of land is conquered and the next neighbours are European colonial powers with whom there's at least an attempt made at solving colonial dispute diplomatically rather than by war, and so the need for soldiers from the Khoisan or the Mfengu recedes and if they don't need to have bullets, the settlers don't see the point of granting them ballots either.
Yes, exactly. I am sceptical of the chances of any kind of South African federation or union with a liberal franchise. Because the whole point of the federation was to reduce the need for defence.
A Cape with reduced borders and surrounded by native Kingdoms on the other hand is much more likely to still need African soldiers and so keep them on side.
The more of these articles, I write, the more I really want to write a proper no scramble scenario because it'll just be so interesting.
- Location
- Coventry
I didn't know about the early suffrage (and its end) in south Africa, that's fascinating
It's a fascinating thing.
As I often point out, on paper Rhodesia never had a racially discrimitory franchise.
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This is a really excellent piece; humane and forgiving, but not unsparing. So often writers on these movements fall either into the traps of ‘these idiot savages’ or ‘it made sense in their world view so we can’t say it was a mistake.’
A no scramble scenario would be fascinating to work on- I suppose, at a minimum, you’d need PODs in the Franco Prussian war and then in Egypt to moderate the crisis of the Khedivate.
A no scramble scenario would be fascinating to work on- I suppose, at a minimum, you’d need PODs in the Franco Prussian war and then in Egypt to moderate the crisis of the Khedivate.
- Pronouns
- he/him
This is a really excellent piece; humane and forgiving, but not unsparing. So often writers on these movements fall either into the traps of ‘these idiot savages’ or ‘it made sense in their world view so we can’t say it was a mistake.’
I suspect you mean the Xhosa article rather than this one, (my own fault for the cryptic names) but thank you. I appreciate the praise.
A no scramble scenario would be fascinating to work on- I suppose, at a minimum, you’d need PODs in the Franco Prussian war and then in Egypt to moderate the crisis of the Khedivate.
Egypt and Tunisia are the first dominos, you prevent them and the rest is so much easier. Then there's less pressure for Bismarck to change his mind so you have him hold firm on no german colonies, you prevent Rhodes and Leopold going anywhere (or kill them off), and force Ferry to push France's ambitions elsewhere. It's not easy, but I'd be inclined to handwave a lot of it.
I'm hoping to get these articles all collected in a book (I have 8 more fully written and 9 more outlined and then I'll be done and will have written around 150,000 words).
And I'm talking with a possible cowriter about sitting down and just working on a single scenario where the scramble is very limited and so what does Samori Ture do and what happens to Zanzibar and how does Dahomey develop etc, etc. Proper old school AH but focused entirely on the continent and the civilisations introduced in the articles.
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- he/him
I suspect you mean the Xhosa article rather than this one, (my own fault for the cryptic names) but thank you. I appreciate the praise.
... how did my post end up here? Ah, the joys of trying to post on your phone.