IOTL, in 1987, Morocco applied to join the European Communities (the precursor to the European Union), but their application was rejected on the grounds that Morocco was not considered to be a "European country" (by the Commission and the European Council, thanks to Spain exercising its veto), and hence could not join; with this geographic membership criterion later enshrined in the Copenhagen criteria (but with the application of Cyprus in 2004 still accepted regardless of not geographically being European). So then, how much do you think things might have changed if Spain hadn't exercised its veto, and if Morocco's application to join the EC had been accepted, and Morocco had subsequently become a full member of the European Union upon the Communities' incorporation into the EU six years later?
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WI: Morocco admitted to the EC?
- Thread starter SinghSong
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Reminded of this particularly 'farfetched' leave EU leaflet during the 2016 referendum.
Given the hostility mostly white Christian eastern european immigrants have faced when working in the west, I shudder to think of the popularity of right wing euro sceptical parties in a world with islamic members of the EU.
Given the hostility mostly white Christian eastern european immigrants have faced when working in the west, I shudder to think of the popularity of right wing euro sceptical parties in a world with islamic members of the EU.
rfmcdonald
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I suspect that the rejection of Morocco was overdetermined. If it was not Spain, it would have been someone. The political and economic criteria for EU membership were clear, and a desperately poor absolute monarchy fighting an insurgency on an internationally disputed frontier fell far short. Turkey would have been far more qualified.
Could there have been more of an EU-Moroccan relationship? Maybe. Perhaps if you had more outsourcing, had Morocco join central Europe as a place for offshore stuff?
Could there have been more of an EU-Moroccan relationship? Maybe. Perhaps if you had more outsourcing, had Morocco join central Europe as a place for offshore stuff?
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I like how they can't imagine Norway joining, but much of the Islamic world doing so.Reminded of this particularly 'farfetched' leave EU leaflet during the 2016 referendum.
Given the hostility mostly white Christian eastern european immigrants have faced when working in the west, I shudder to think of the popularity of right wing euro sceptical parties in a world with islamic members of the EU.
I also like how they view Palestine as its own country (given these are Brexiteers they wouldn't strike me as the type to do so).
Also Nakhchivan joining separately from Azerbaijan.
Yeah, even a Turkey which was rapidly qualifying for EU-membership was rejected in the mid-2000s by Sarkozy.
Yeah, I know it wasn't particularly likely, but still. How do you think that things would have progressed, had this actually happened and Morocco accepted as a member (regardless of how improbable it might have been for this to happen without being vetoed)?
Ricardolindo
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No offense, but there is a problem with this kind of questions. How something unlikely happens will affect the results.
Regardless, Morocco would have to implement liberal reforms which will cause problems with conservative Muslims.
I'm not sure of the impact on Morroco - though probably "messy" as it requires mass liberalisations in a short space of time - but the impact on racists, good Christ. The continent be drowning on leaflets about how any given country has to leave before Them come. It'd likely gum up the works for Schengen, as countries go "well ACTUALLY" about the thing they've signed now it could mean Moroccans coming. It probably makes it harder to expand in general. The European project probably gets a shot in the kneecaps basically.
This also means the Moroccans (and the liberals too because they'll be the ones invested and travelling) probably get narked off about being members and yet treated like shit. "What are we getting out of this?"
This also means the Moroccans (and the liberals too because they'll be the ones invested and travelling) probably get narked off about being members and yet treated like shit. "What are we getting out of this?"
rfmcdonald
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If this happened, the problem is that the process of European integration that Morocco would be joining would be very different, so much so as to be unrecognizable.
At the very start of the European project, there was some thought of western European reunification being a way to consolidate and rationalize colonized Africa. Bringing West Germany in an effort to develop the mainly Franco-Belgian territories did have an appeal. This spin on the European project, which would have made Francophone Africa including the Maghreb explicitly into a European hinterland, was ended by decolonization.
Presumably Morocco would be getting a lot of funding, but yes, especially since Morocco is so poor and since there are already large Moroccan communities in most of Europe, as soon as Moroccans got freedom of movement you would see a big shift.
Mind, the political changes required of Morocco would be huge. There would simply be no way that an authoritarian monarchy could be handwaved in; Morocco would need to transform politically, on the model of Mediterranean Europe in the previous decade. Could this even be possible?
I know this kind of sounds like something out of a bad, problematic (in multiple ways) thriller novel, but I got the idea of conspirators using Morocco as a sort of poison pill and steering its application through, knowing the difficulties such a clearly bad fit would pose for European integration.
rfmcdonald
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Quite.
I does remind me of the Cold War era Latvian joke, where Moscow granted Latvia one last day of independence and the Latvians used that to first declare war on and then surrender to Sweden. It is a provocative idea, but it is also a wholly unworkable one, ignoring Soviet and Latvian and Swedish interests and patterns of behaviour. Taking this Moroccan bid that seriously strikes me as the same sort of mistake.
It is a sad possibility but do you think it's something that could actually happen, or at least attempted?
rfmcdonald
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I was not the person that was asked, but the hurdles are so great—a definitely non-European conservative personal monarchy lacking much by way of a developed market economy or political democracy and civil rights—that I cannot see this bid flying. You would somehow have to convince all of the member-states to do something clearly not in their interests or those of the wider EEC. Even if one member-state simply would not get off the topic, it would not be able to force it; the most that it could plausibly do would be to jam up the workings of the EEC.
A Moroccan bid could be viable only if things were very different. If you did somehow manage to get a decolonization of Africa that involved the French and Belgian colonies becoming annexes of the EEC, then in that context a Morocco progressing to membership in its own right could work. Maybe.
A Moroccan bid could be viable only if things were very different. If you did somehow manage to get a decolonization of Africa that involved the French and Belgian colonies becoming annexes of the EEC, then in that context a Morocco progressing to membership in its own right could work. Maybe.