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WI a Trinidad solution for the Southern states?

Hendryk

Taken back control yet?
Published by SLP
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Given the enduring popularity of American Civil War-related themes in alternate history, I'm wondering if anyone has already explored a variant, namely: what if slavery is abolished in the Southern states shortly after indepedence, and plantation owners instead begin importing large numbers of South and East Asian indentured laborers? What would be the social and cultural effects on the US?

The British did this for their Trinidad plantations, and as a result the island is now 38% East Indian.
 
There are a couple of problems with this:

1. Why would the South decide to abolish slavery right after independence? The South was very wedded to slavery, which is why things like the 3/5ths Compromise were necessary. Furthermore, abolitionism wasn't a mass movement in the 1780s, and while a lot of the Founding Fathers weren't completely comfortable with slavery they believed that the issue should be settled in the future (read: after they were dead).

2. Where are they going to get the laborers? Britain was able to get indentured servants because the East India Company controlled large parts of India, and other countries were able to get indentured servants because of agreements that they made with Britain. The British probably aren't going to make a deal with a former colony they just fought a war against, so there's no way for the South to import all of these people.
 
what if slavery is abolished in the Southern states shortly after indepedence
Why would they do that when they've literally just fought armed rebellion against the US and gotten themselves a Constitution exactly like the US Constitution, except that it explicitly enshrined the institution of slavery?
 
Why would they do that when they've literally just fought armed rebellion against the US and gotten themselves a Constitution exactly like the US Constitution, except that it explicitly enshrined the institution of slavery?
Apparently Georgia very nearly abolished slavery in the 1750s, but a spirited effort by Great Awakening preacher George Whitefield to remind Georgians of their Godly duty managed to turn the tide. Thank Heaven for such men of conviction.

Anyway this is more of a thought experiment. Feel free to come up with any reason, whether a delayed invention of the cotton gin, Toussaint Louverture or one of his followers leading a large-scale slave revolt, whatever.
 
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Apparently Georgia very nearly abolished slavery in the 1750s, but a spirited effort by a Great Awakening preacher George Whitefield to remind Georgians of their Godly duty managed to turn the tide. Thank Heaven for such men of conviction.
Yep, in the 1750s, while a century later they fought an armed revolution to preserve the institution of slavery to the point the Union burned the earth
 
The British had an Empire on that side of the World the Americans didn't. If you want to change the nature of bondage in the American South you'd probably do better to try and create a peonage system but you probaly have to go back to 1676 to do it.
 
OTL there was experimentation with Chinese laborers in the South during Reconstruction up until the Chinese Exclusion Act. Now I think the logistics of getting enough Chinese laborers to the South to be like Trinidad is unrealistic but I think you could easily have a sizable Chinese population in the South with the right circumstances.
 
The British had an Empire on that side of the World the Americans didn't. If you want to change the nature of bondage in the American South you'd probably do better to try and create a peonage system but you probaly have to go back to 1676 to do it.

Historically speaking the nature of slavery in the South differed depending on which colony you're talking about. The case of Virginia, for example, where a good portion of the Founding Fathers and some of the first Presidents were from, is a case in point. (Note that I'd be channeling Colin Woodard here, so apologies in advance.) In Virginia, the original aim was not to create the classic slavery system we're all familiar with, but a recreation of life of pre-Civil War England (though one could argue it was an attempt to recreate medieval England). One aspect of recreating England in the New World - and particularly rural England - is the need to recreate a class system similar to what existed in England at the time (though I'm definitely oversimplifying here), with an aristocracy on top, professionals and gentry in the middle, followed by yeoman and lastly by serfs, servants, and what (to use an anachronistic modern term) we would call "white trash" but at the time of colonization would have been designated with other, more contemporary, terms of abuse, such as lubbers which the colonial authorities railed against bringing to the New World (but which happened anyway). When Africans were brought to Virginia, it was within the serf/servant category that in a Colonial North America context we'd call "indentured servants"; while it resembled slavery on the outside, the devil is in the details because in compliance with the traditional rules of the class system of the time, the plantation owner had obligations to his serfs which needed to be met, and vice versa - much like the classic feudal/manorial model in Europe, where the lord of the manor had feudal obligations to his serfs which the serfs 'repaid' in kind with their labor (i.e. the corvée, agricultural work, etc.).

(There were other things at work to try to recreate life in pre-Civil War England in Virginia, such as for example the House of Burgesses as a partial replica of Parliament and an established church - which invariably meant the Church of England, as it was for England and Wales at this time, and little space for Dissenters who could not preach without a license - but they are tangential to the topic. Yet when one includes them it presents a fuller picture of what Virginia's leaders thought their colony was like and the reality to everyone else.)

It's this archetype of slavery in Virginia that slavery apologists today refer to (even though they don't know it) when they assert "slavery wasn't all that bad", yet what slavery apologists leave out is that because of its unique nature in Virginia, as a result of the Revolution it could have been possible to abolish slavery and transition to something more similar to the contemporary UK (around the time the Industrial Revolution was booming). By contrast, elsewhere in the South where slavery existed, it was more of a Latin American type (and in particular similar to slavery in Brazil) that echoed what had already occurred in the British Caribbean, in places like Barbados in particular where the regime was unusually harsh even by contemporary standards. That is the type of slavery which prospered as a result of the cotton gin and which became emblematic of slavery as Americans understood it - the reality of slavery that modern apologists for slavery hide. This too could be the model where the "Trinidad solution" would work best, though in that case it would have to be after the Civil War if one wanted to perpetuate slavery - but it can't be called slavery, as that was one of the reasons the North and the South fought each other; one would need to use euphemisms like "contract labor" or "peonage" - in the Western Hemisphere peonage was a very Latin American construct that was brought over after the Civil War (though not use the exact term). Thus for anything south of Virginia a Civil War POD would be needed, and in particular a POD during Reconstruction. Alternatively, if one wanted an early abolition of slavery then one would need to treat the South as an inverse of New England, with Virginia proper taking on the role of the Massachusetts Bay Colony and all other areas in the South breaking off from Virginia and/or treating Virginia as a general name covering most of the South as a specific region like New England is for a specific section of the Northeast - and for that a POD in the colonial era is absolutely required since one would need to prevent the establishment of South Carolina for it to work.

TL;DR - a "Trinidad solution" is possible, but only for certain areas and with a Reconstruction POD. The OP could be met only for those colonies/states, apparently, which touch Chesapeake Bay due to peculiar historical circumstances specific to those colonies/states and because Virginia was the epicenter of early abolitionist sentiment during the Revolutionary era and was among the last areas to adopt the cotton gin.
 
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Apparently Georgia very nearly abolished slavery in the 1750s, but a spirited effort by Great Awakening preacher George Whitefield to remind Georgians of their Godly duty managed to turn the tide. Thank Heaven for such men of conviction.
yet what slavery apologists leave out is that because of its unique nature in Virginia, as a result of the Revolution it could have been possible to abolish slavery and transition to something more similar to the contemporary UK (around the time the Industrial Revolution was booming).

This feels like an interesting combination of events to build something off of- Georgia abolishes slavery in the 1750s, giving a slight boost to the pro-abolitionist faction in Virginia (and the Carolinas but it doesn't help there) and by the 1780s/90s its starting to fade off there and be replaced with industrialised processes (a process that probably isn't complete until the 1820s or 30s and sees, among other things, the relatively uncontroversial entry of Kentucky as a Free State in any sort of US which emerges here) and then, perhaps, Slavery is just a thing that happens in the Carolinas allowing for a later limited intervention and transition to imported labour.

Just spitballing of course.
 
Wouldn't abolition in Virginia also affect the Carolinas in that OTL a lot of their slaves came from Virginia because they worked too many of them to death to manage a replacement rate from births?
 
Wouldn't abolition in Virginia also affect the Carolinas in that OTL a lot of their slaves came from Virginia because they worked too many of them to death to manage a replacement rate from births?

Quite possibly. I suspect it would push them to finding ways to 'increase production' domestically at least initially however.

Yech, I feel a bit dirty just writing that.
 
Wouldn't abolition in Virginia also affect the Carolinas in that OTL a lot of their slaves came from Virginia because they worked too many of them to death to manage a replacement rate from births?

This is where it gets interesting, and in particular coastal North Carolina would be a test case. Now, northern coastal North Carolina is traditionally considered part of the Tidewater region along with a good portion of Virginia (including Virginia's Hampton Roads regions) since indeed colonization in those areas came from the north. Southern coastal North Carolina, OTOH, was in the orbit of Charleston, as the nexus of bringing their model of slavery from Barbados to the Deep South, for the simple reason that the classic slavery model was so intensive that it drained out whatever nutrients there were in the soil and thus made Barbados useless for cash crop cultivation (at least for a time). So it wasn't just the human factor involved in the Deep South, it was also an environmental factor. So if Virginia abolished slavery, then in North Carolina the "battle" would be fierce indeed - a mini-civil war, if you will, within the same colony, even if abolition did occur in North Carolina's Tidewater region. The closest parallel, though not quite exact, I can think of for a British/European audience would be the Irish rebellions of 1798, if that helps. Then and only then could the Deep South try to substitute "unreliable" labor with other people more "willing" to accept the job. Otherwise, @Alex Richards 's post above me also applies.
 
Given the enduring popularity of American Civil War-related themes in alternate history, I'm wondering if anyone has already explored a variant, namely: what if slavery is abolished in the Southern states shortly after indepedence, and plantation owners instead begin importing large numbers of South and East Asian indentured laborers? What would be the social and cultural effects on the US?

The British did this for their Trinidad plantations, and as a result the island is now 38% East Indian.
Weren't the indentures largely because following the abolition of the slave trade in the Carribean landowners needed some, um, more expendable labor? America it would seem would not "need" indentured labor as by the time such things were on the table because unlike the Carribean, who mostly imported their slaves right off the boat, American slavery by independence (with some exceptions) relied on natural increase for their supply Yes, you had places like South Carolina and Mississippi, but in those cases they could buy slaves from the Upper South relatively easily.

Perhaps what you'd need is a looser United States, akin if not identical to the Articles of Confederation, but somehow they prohibit the international slave trade (plausible, especially if Britain maintaints its early 19th century attitude to the slave trade). Higher barriers to importing slaves would create the incentives for indentured labor.

@Dan1988 's proposal of a Reconstruction POD also does not seem to work either, as by the time slavery was abolished in the United States, the role that the Trinidadian Indians would fill - that of contract labor where the worker was at an extreme disadvantage - had already been filled by freedmen - first through the Black Codes, and after they got struck down, a combination of Reconstruction policy emphasizing white "employers" and the development of the sharecropping system in the cash crop sectors like cotton and sugar.

TLDR: you'd need to have the American South rely primarily on importing slaves from outside the country in the decades before the abolition of the slave trade.
 
As many have mentioned, Britain could use Indians because India was in its grasp. France also took use of Indian indentured servants, but it used its leftover ports in the subcontinent to recruit them, which is why many more Tamils were brought over by the French. I cannot think of any possible way the US could take over even a single Indian port. So, you need other ethnicities.

Another factor is that the US post-ACA would not look to kindly on an institution resembling slavery. IOTL, even in Britain, there was something of a movement to ban indenture for that precise reason, and it succeeded for a while before, unfortunately, it was overturned. In the US, immediately after a war against slavery, I can’t imagine it looking very kindly at such an institution.
 
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