- Pronouns
- he/him
-
Hi Guest!
The costs of running this forum are covered by Sea Lion Press. If you'd like to help support the company and the forum, visit patreon.com/sealionpress
How Germany Was Divided: A History of Partition Plans
- Thread starter Gary Oswald
- Start date
I do like how Churchill's desire for a Bavarian-Austrian-Hungarian confederation along the Danube is just your bog-standard AH "I like the idea of this country let's have it."
Also he and Stalin clearly felt the need to take Roosevelt to task for the lazy use of straight borders when there were plenty existing ones he could have traced.
Also he and Stalin clearly felt the need to take Roosevelt to task for the lazy use of straight borders when there were plenty existing ones he could have traced.
A very nice article. I remember on the other place Chris S (who I don't believe is a member here) frequently mapped occupations of Germany and alternate plans:
https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/the-new-our-timeline-maps-thread.26295/page-183#post-9968940
https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/the-new-our-timeline-maps-thread.26295/page-183#post-9968940
- Location
- Doncaster/ Sheffield
Great topic for an article! Glad this collaboration is working out.
- Location
- Derbyshire
It's the smaller things- like the Belgian zone and the brief Polish occupation area (as in Free Poland)- that really fascinate me about this era.
Loved the article, it's one of those fascinating periods of recent history where things can change significantly.
I'm actually working on a map for this scenario.
Add Czechoslovakia and it's the return of the Austro-Hungarian empire, minus the Habsburgs.I do like how Churchill's desire for a Bavarian-Austrian-Hungarian confederation along the Danube is just your bog-standard AH "I like the idea of this country let's have it"
I'm actually working on a map for this scenario.
The same guy writing "let's permanently cripple those fucking Germans" and driving European unions with Germany is one of those quirks of history that seems wrong when you write it down.
I had not known the USSR getting a role in Germany was something Churchill proposed (and withouit asking Roosevelt?!), though I now wonder what would've happened without that since the USSR would still have been invading the place and I can't see Stalin wanting to leave & trusting the West won't rebuild Germany to attack Russia a third time that century
I had not known the USSR getting a role in Germany was something Churchill proposed (and withouit asking Roosevelt?!), though I now wonder what would've happened without that since the USSR would still have been invading the place and I can't see Stalin wanting to leave & trusting the West won't rebuild Germany to attack Russia a third time that century
- Pronouns
- he/him
Roosevelt's original plan was that only the territory east of berlin would be the soviet Zone, as in mostly the stuff that was ceded to Poland and the USSR.The same guy writing "let's permanently cripple those fucking Germans" and driving European unions with Germany is one of those quirks of history that seems wrong when you write it down.
I had not known the USSR getting a role in Germany was something Churchill proposed (and withouit asking Roosevelt?!), though I now wonder what would've happened without that since the USSR would still have been invading the place and I can't see Stalin wanting to leave & trusting the West won't rebuild Germany to attack Russia a third time that century
The idea being that the soviets could smash up prussia while the western allies rebuilt the rest of Germany which was seen as less militant.
What Churchill did was invite Stalin west of Berlin into what became East Germany.
Churchill is loudly talking about the importance of traditional boundaries and drawing the Soviet territory further and further west while Stalin just nods and smiles.What Churchill did was invite Stalin west of Berlin into what became East Germany.
- Location
- Balham
- Pronouns
- he/him
The Belgian zone inspired Zonen.It's the smaller things- like the Belgian zone and the brief Polish occupation area (as in Free Poland)- that really fascinate me about this era.
- Location
- Derbyshire
Indian troops being used in the Occupation force in Japan as well, though there wasn't specifically an Indian zone.The Belgian zone inspired Zonen.
For complete head-fuckery, he was a major mover and shaker in the LoN, then was the guy who pushed the Franco-British union during the fall of France. Huge de Gaulle opponent (including poisoning the well re FDR) and then one of his major people. Was a big financier and also father of France's planification.The same guy writing "let's permanently cripple those fucking Germans" and driving European unions with Germany is one of those quirks of history that seems wrong when you write it down.
In conclusion Jean Monnet is a land of contrasts.
How did the Japanese take it? About as well as the Germans toward the "Force noire" after WWI?Indian troops being used in the Occupation force in Japan as well, though there wasn't specifically an Indian zone.
Seem to remember he was a fan of one Mr. Albert Speer, before the war at least.For complete head-fuckery, he was a major mover and shaker in the LoN, then was the guy who pushed the Franco-British union during the fall of France. Huge de Gaulle opponent (including poisoning the well re FDR) and then one of his major people. Was a big financier and also father of France's planification.
In conclusion Jean Monnet is a land of contrasts.
Underused in AH is Johnny Monnet.
- Location
- Derbyshire
No idea, would be interesting to look up actually.How did the Japanese take it? About as well as the Germans toward the "Force noire" after WWI?
- Location
- Doncaster/ Sheffield
It's like that bit I like to bring up about how Reagan and Thatcher's advisors apparently had to really convince them that it would be better for the West if Gorbachev rather than Romanov became the next Soviet leader. "But wouldn't it be, like, really cool and ironic if..."I do like how Churchill's desire for a Bavarian-Austrian-Hungarian confederation along the Danube is just your bog-standard AH "I like the idea of this country let's have it."
Also he and Stalin clearly felt the need to take Roosevelt to task for the lazy use of straight borders when there were plenty existing ones he could have traced.
Thank you for the republication!
I love this alt-history map of a Danube Confederation, which imagines that in the present day Georg von Habsburg, the grandson of the last king of Austria-Hungary, Charles I, would be the ceremonial head of state.
I love this alt-history map of a Danube Confederation, which imagines that in the present day Georg von Habsburg, the grandson of the last king of Austria-Hungary, Charles I, would be the ceremonial head of state.
- Location
- Doncaster/ Sheffield
I enjoyed the article!Thank you for the republication!
I love this alt-history map of a Danube Confederation, which imagines that in the present day Georg von Habsburg, the grandson of the last king of Austria-Hungary, Charles I, would be the ceremonial head of state.
Funny how history works out - I've been planning an alt-Cold War scenario for years that involved a state a bit like that, but I thought I'd have to abandon the idea because it was too far-fetched...whereas my idea was less far-fetched than that (it was just Austro-Bavaria without Hungary).
That shape...Thank you for the republication!
I love this alt-history map of a Danube Confederation, which imagines that in the present day Georg von Habsburg, the grandson of the last king of Austria-Hungary, Charles I, would be the ceremonial head of state.