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Forgotten Conflicts: The Libyan-Chadian War

Von Callay

Kept After Class by Mrs. MacBrayne
#2
The Chadians at this time had also learned that the Pickup trucks would not set off a Libyan Landmine, if they were moving at over 100 kilometres per hour when they drove over them.

Of all the ways I expected to learn that someone avoided death in a minefield, 'recklessly accelerating his pickup truck to over 100kph' was never going to be one of them.
 
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Charles EP M.

Well-known member
Published by SLP
#3
"Libya could have carved out a small empire and also gained uranium" does seem like it should be a bigger deal in AH speculation and historical knowledge, doesn't it?

(Do the French remember it as a big deal or "oh yeah that"?)
 

Alex Richards

She needs an artificial Mountain, not AV
Patreon supporter
Published by SLP
Location
Derbyshire
#4
"Libya could have carved out a small empire and also gained uranium" does seem like it should be a bigger deal in AH speculation and historical knowledge, doesn't it?

(Do the French remember it as a big deal or "oh yeah that"?)
I feel like the possibility of 'Gadaffi carves out a small Empire stretching from the Med to the Congo, overstretches himself and then gets overthrown by a broad alliance of Pro-Democracy, dissident military and nationalist groups backed by basically everyone in North Africa' is also quite juicy a possibility.
 

David Flin

A home of love and laughter.
#5
I feel like the possibility of 'Gadaffi carves out a small Empire stretching from the Med to the Congo, overstretches himself and then gets overthrown by a broad alliance of Pro-Democracy, dissident military and nationalist groups backed by basically everyone in North Africa' is also quite juicy a possibility.
It could get complicated, because Gadaffi was on good terms with the PLO at the time (PLO forces gave assistance in this war). There's also the butterflies that may arise from the Uganda/Tanzania war of 1978-79, in which the best of the Ugandan forces were Libyan and Palestinian. Changes in one could easily impact the other.
 

Thande

The Great and Powerful Wizard, Opnohop Moy
Published by SLP
#6
The Chadians at this time had also learned that the Pickup trucks would not set off a Libyan Landmine, if they were moving at over 100 kilometres per hour when they drove over them.

Of all the ways I expected to learn that someone avoided death in a minefield, 'wrecklessly accelerating his pickup truck to over 100kph' was never going to be one of them.
The popularisation of "technical" pickup trucks as weapons of war are probably the best-known aspect of the war in the west (although people may not know that's where they originate). They even appeared in Command & Conquer: Generals!
 

Gary Oswald

Old and Foolish now
Sea Lion Press staff
Pronouns
he/him
#7
It could get complicated, because Gadaffi was on good terms with the PLO at the time (PLO forces gave assistance in this war). There's also the butterflies that may arise from the Uganda/Tanzania war of 1978-79, in which the best of the Ugandan forces were Libyan and Palestinian. Changes in one could easily impact the other.
There's a wonderful book called 'Africa's 30 Years War' which argues that the Chadian civil war became the playground for African power struggles and you can trace a lot of subsequent conflicts in neighbouring countries like Sudan and Uganda to it.

I think it would be very tight in terms of logistics for Gaddafi to have time to fully enshrine Goukouni as his puppet ruler in Chad in 78 and then be able to pivot from that to invest enough forces in Uganda to stop Amin from falling in 1979. Though his troops would be a lot closer if the French hadn't stopped him, I guess and the airlift of Libyan troops to remove Habre in 81 was genuinely impressive.

More likely you'd perhaps see Libya lose Chad either to the likes of Habre or because Goukouni cuts the puppet strings if they invest too much in fighting Tanzania.
 

Thande

The Great and Powerful Wizard, Opnohop Moy
Published by SLP
#9
I feel like there's a whole bunch of wars in post-colonial Africa that I don't know about at all, other than them being endlessly confusing.
There's often very high name recognition with a very specific generational group of people who remember seeing it on the TV news at a certain age, and none outside of that. (Cf: Biafra, Katanga).
 

Hendryk

Nothing ever ends
Published by SLP
Location
France
#10
There's often very high name recognition with a very specific generational group of people who remember seeing it on the TV news at a certain age, and none outside of that. (Cf: Biafra, Katanga).
This specific conflict is one of those for me. I was a teen at the time, and I remember that the Aozou Strip came up in the news every once in a while.
 

Redolegna

Champagne Socialist
Moderator
Published by SLP
Location
Paris
Pronouns
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#12
"Libya could have carved out a small empire and also gained uranium" does seem like it should be a bigger deal in AH speculation and historical knowledge, doesn't it?

(Do the French remember it as a big deal or "oh yeah that"?)
Which French? The diplomatic service, certainly, the general public, not at all I’d bet.
There's often very high name recognition with a very specific generational group of people who remember seeing it on the TV news at a certain age, and none outside of that. (Cf: Biafra, Katanga).
Biafra led to Doctors Without Borders being established so it has had a chance to stick some more in memory.
 

Agentdark

Member
Published by SLP
#13
The Chadians at this time had also learned that the Pickup trucks would not set off a Libyan Landmine, if they were moving at over 100 kilometres per hour when they drove over them.

Of all the ways I expected to learn that someone avoided death in a minefield, 'recklessly accelerating his pickup truck to over 100kph' was never going to be one of them.
i would pay alot to be a fly on the wall for when Chad figured this out.
The popularisation of "technical" pickup trucks as weapons of war are probably the best-known aspect of the war in the west (although people may not know that's where they originate). They even appeared in Command & Conquer: Generals!
I miss that game so much
I feel like there's a whole bunch of wars in post-colonial Africa that I don't know about at all, other than them being endlessly confusing.
I have several more in my head. Eritera and Ethiopia is liable to happen, as is the Ogaden War.
 

M_Kresal

I am nerd, hear me bore.
Published by SLP
Location
North Alabama
#17
Does a SCUD have the range ro hit Corsica from Libya?
Range on a Scud varies wildly between the different variants, but IIRC the maximum range was about 450 miles. It’s one of the reasons that the Iraqis had Gerald Bull working on a version of it with multiple unarmed Scuds essentially tied around one with one with a warhead on board in the 1980s as a side project to his super gun.
 

Geordie

Benoit Beef-foot
Published by SLP
Pronouns
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#18
It could get complicated, because Gadaffi was on good terms with the PLO at the time (PLO forces gave assistance in this war). There's also the butterflies that may arise from the Uganda/Tanzania war of 1978-79, in which the best of the Ugandan forces were Libyan and Palestinian. Changes in one could easily impact the other.
I found the ripples heading out towards Libya and even Uganda one of the more fascinating aspects of The Death of Lt. Arthur Windsor, RN.

Well, that and the IRA/Blondie/Tweenies mashup.
 

David Flin

A home of love and laughter.
#19
I found the ripples heading out towards Libya and even Uganda one of the more fascinating aspects of The Death of Lt. Arthur Windsor, RN.

Well, that and the IRA/Blondie/Tweenies mashup.
Oh, the IRA/Blondie/Tweenies mashup was a huge error of judgement, in many ways. I was getting too clever for the story, dropping things in because they felt neat, not because they fitted.

That said, the whole Uganda/Tanzania war, and the other ripples were interesting (to me, anyway). If I was doing that timeline now, I would do it very differently.
 

ForceA1

Pro-VAXer*
Pronouns
He/Him
#20
Range on a Scud varies wildly between the different variants, but IIRC the maximum range was about 450 miles. It’s one of the reasons that the Iraqis had Gerald Bull working on a version of it with multiple unarmed Scuds essentially tied around one with one with a warhead on board in the 1980s as a side project to his super gun.
Libya only had Scud-Bs, which had a much shorter range than the reverse-engineered Iraqi examples.