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Different left candidate in 2015 Labour leadership election

Tamar

Tamar

when nobody is watching, what do you believe?
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During the scramble to find a candidate of their own for the 2015 Labour leadership election, the Labour left reportedly considered candidates other than Jeremy Corbyn, including Jon Trickett or Lisa Nandy.

So what if Trickett or Nandy or somebody else had been the left candidate after all? Might they have inspired a similar membership surge and won the leadership? If so, being seen as more loyalist than Corbyn, might they have had a better chance of uniting most of the party from the get-go? How might a different Labour leader change the EU referendum?
 
Heat said:
During the scramble to find a candidate of their own for the 2015 Labour leadership election, the Labour left reportedly considered candidates other than Jeremy Corbyn, including Jon Trickett or Lisa Nandy.

So what if Trickett or Nandy or somebody else had been the left candidate after all? Might they have inspired a similar membership surge and won the leadership? If so, being seen as more loyalist than Corbyn, might they have had a better chance of uniting most of the party from the get-go? How might a different Labour leader change the EU referendum?
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Well McDonnell and Abbot had both done pretty badly in 2007 and 10 respectively so it's really a question of "Was the left always going to win" or "Is Corbyn the reason the left won"

If the former - and I don't think that's the case - then no it doesn't matter. If the latter than presumably they'd have lost with anyone else

Personally I think it's the latter. Without Corbyns charisma I don't think the left success. If Nandy had drawn the short straw and turned out to be as stupifyingly dull as Cooper and Burnham then we'd probably have seen Burnham inch his way to a win and we all snooze through the victory speech
 
KingCrawa said:
Well McDonnell and Abbot had both done pretty badly in 2007 and 10 respectively so it's really a question of "Was the left always going to win" or "Is Corbyn the reason the left won"

If the former - and I don't think that's the case - then no it doesn't matter. If the latter than presumably they'd have lost with anyone else

Personally I think it's the latter. Without Corbyns charisma I don't think the left success. If Nandy had drawn the short straw and turned out to be as stupifyingly dull as Cooper and Burnham then we'd probably have seen Burnham inch his way to a win and we all snooze through the victory speech
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I think Nandy's limited time in office and more standard media style may have lead to her not distinguishing herself, but on the other hand I think Corbyn's victory was a real result of the just stupefyingly depressing campaign in 2015,when many people felt "well we're not going to win anyway so let's at least say what we mean." I think Labour's depressing status with most of the left in 2015 was also a big part of it. I remember reading in an Owen Jones article that campaigning for Labour was something left-wing people were meant to do, and I'd literally never heard the viewpoint that leftwingers voted Labour with anything more than grudging indifference before.
 
Trickett was something of the favourite potential left wing candidate. Owen Jones tried to get Nandy the to stand but it was never going to happen as I believe she had just had a child. I doubt Trickett would have gained the same degree of activist popularity or youth engagement but certainly would have gained a greater degree of support from the PLP mainstream. Not much, but still more than our Jez.

Imagine the shadow cabinet to be a lot like what happened otl, particularly with top jobs for Angela Eagle and Hilary Benn, and probably a greater appearance for Cooper/Burnham etc. Johnny Mac would have of course come no where near power.

I expect the situation would have been a bland left-Milibandism which would have failed to achieve much in any potential snap election, if it would even happen. Blairite grumblings all he way up to a disappointing 2019/20 election result
 
McDonnell Will Sort It.

That’s part-banter and part-seriousness. He’s got the same ‘old man in jumper’ look about him, but has a certain degree of professionalism that helps with mainstream commentators (and avoids Cameron’s style-shaming antics). He talks the staunch left-wing talk and walks the staunch left-wing talk, and there’s nobody better placed to implement Corbyn’s OTL changes than Johnny Mac.

He does, however, come up against the fact that his personality is less ‘grandfatherly and sweet geography teacher who makes the teenage girls swoon’ and more ‘I will cut you, you stuck-up piece of shit’. Here, he falls down by making the left-wing brand more combative. It could also be argued the other way, but I’m sure that Corbyn’s personality makes a huge difference with young members who genuinely want a soft-spoken older man who agrees with their views against their neoliberal Centrist Dads. McDonnell can only go so far in that direction before he threatens to cut Theresa May’s brakes.

Nandy won’t stand because of her responsibilities as a young mother, as has been mentioned; Trickett can’t shake off all the New Labour associations and will have to go through similar struggles with Remainers in the Labour Party, and Ian Lavery is Ian Lavery.
 
Comisario said:
McDonnell Will Sort It.

That’s part-banter and part-seriousness. He’s got the same ‘old man in jumper’ look about him, but has a certain degree of professionalism that helps with mainstream commentators (and avoids Cameron’s style-shaming antics). He talks the staunch left-wing talk and walks the staunch left-wing talk, and there’s nobody better placed to implement Corbyn’s OTL changes than Johnny Mac.

He does, however, come up against the fact that his personality is less ‘grandfatherly and sweet geography teacher who makes the teenage girls swoon’ and more ‘I will cut you, you stuck-up piece of shit’. Here, he falls down by making the left-wing brand more combative. It could also be argued the other way, but I’m sure that Corbyn’s personality makes a huge difference with young members who genuinely want a soft-spoken older man who agrees with their views against their neoliberal Centrist Dads. McDonnell can only go so far in that direction before he threatens to cut Theresa May’s brakes.

Nandy won’t stand because of her responsibilities as a young mother, as has been mentioned; Trickett can’t shake off all the New Labour associations and will have to go through similar struggles with Remainers in the Labour Party, and Ian Lavery is Ian Lavery.
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I think I agree, but what I had heard was that McDonnell could actually get so abrasive behind the scenes that he wouldn't be able to get the pity nominations Corbyn did because too many MPs just hated his guts.
 
Heat said:
I think I agree, but what I had heard was that McDonnell could actually get so abrasive behind the scenes that he wouldn't be able to get the pity nominations Corbyn did because too many MPs just hated his guts.
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Yeah, that’s the same as I heard. Still, if he was the left candidate, I see a situation (maybe not a full-on certainty) where he gets the nominations.
 
AlfieJ said:
Of course I’ve also heard people say that if the left had known they would win in 2015 they would have put up Michael Meacher
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Who, of course, died a few months later.

Which is in itself an interesting question to consider - what the hell does that leadership election looks like? I can see the left going 'let our anointed one run unopposed out of respect', the right going 'nah' and it just getting really ugly.
 
Alex Richards said:
Perhaps McDonnell is more likely to actually lose a leadership challenge if another one gets called, but less likely to end up with one in 2016?
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Is he really less likely to attract one though? I mean, much of the PLP will still be looking for any reason to depose him, and it's not like John McDonnell is going to swing the referendum towards Remain, which was what provided the initial pretext for the challenge. You might have better media management which in turn might mitigate the impression of malaise Labour was mired in before the referendum, but that relies on the assumption that McDonnell won't surround himself with incompetent yes-men like Corbyn, or at least surround himself with mildly competent yes-men.
 
Heat said:
Is he really less likely to attract one though? I mean, much of the PLP will still be looking for any reason to depose him, and it's not like John McDonnell is going to swing the referendum towards Remain, which was what provided the initial pretext for the challenge. You might have better media management which in turn might mitigate the impression of malaise Labour was mired in before the referendum, but that relies on the assumption that McDonnell won't surround himself with incompetent yes-men like Corbyn, or at least surround himself with mildly competent yes-men.
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I think John McDonnell might be a bit more active in campaigning for Remain, which would make the accusations of 'didn't campaign properly'.
 
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